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keith in ct

Story on Pirates lease situation

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Hummmmm, I wonder where this is really going. The team has been going down hill ( community involvement/ fan interaction wise ) for a while now. It seems as though the pirates current management doesn't want to be here. I'm sure a better venue would be in their wish list, and I personally would love to have a TD garden like hockey palace here in the great state, but with the amount of excitement ( or rather the lack thereof ) the pirates generate, they would still be playing in an empty barn all the time. How many seats are there in the CCCC, in hockey trim? And when was the last regular season game with all those seats filled? I'm all for cheap and available hockey, but last season I had the misfortune of sitting behind a local TV weather guy, and there of his coworkers, they spent the while time getting drunk and bad mouthing other coworkers. They could a been at a bar and done the same. Go to a Bruins game, what does a cheap seat there run you? I think the higher seat prices keeps those that are just looking to hang out and drink out to other places. If you pony up that kind of cash, you're going to be watching the game and are going to be emotionally involved. Bottom line here, I guess, is it seems Portland Pirates hockey is broken. Can it be repaired? Does anyone even care enough anymore to put forth the effort?

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Civic Center trustees seek legal advice on Pirates

By Chris Roy Published: 4th September 2013

 

PORTLAND – The Cumberland County Civic Center’s Board of Trustees met in executive session with its legal counsel for over three hours Wednesday to discuss its next steps regarding its main tenant, the Portland Pirates.

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I'm used to seeing hard bargining between Petrovek and the trustees, but what makes me a little nervous is how the trustees brought in the lawyers like this. Its less like negotiation and more like "We want to push the nuclear weapon button, what is the fallout if we do?" type of thinking.

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Civic Center, Pirates head for legal showdown

By Chris Roy Published: 5th September 2013

 

PORTLAND – The Cumberland County Civic Center’s Board of Trustees and owners of the Portland Pirates are staring down at a possible courtroom showdown over whether an agreement reached in April constitutes a binding lease agreement.

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I am not a lawyer, but the CCCC is about to get their arse kicked in court. As I have previously found out the hard way a contract doesn't need to be signed to be valid. If the CCCC ends up in court based on the information available they are going to take a hard one up the arse.

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I am not a lawyer, but the CCCC is about to get their arse kicked in court. As I have previously found out the hard way a contract doesn't need to be signed to be valid. If the CCCC ends up in court based on the information available they are going to take a hard one up the arse.

I don't disagree with this, but my understanding is that the major sticking point is a clause that, in its current form, is legally invalid. I'm no lawyer either, but I don't think the court can force the CCCC to abide by an agreement that breaks the law. I feel like the only thing the court can do here is compel the two sides to resume negotiations.

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I am not a lawyer, but the CCCC is about to get their arse kicked in court. As I have previously found out the hard way a contract doesn't need to be signed to be valid. If the CCCC ends up in court based on the information available they are going to take a hard one up the arse.

I don't disagree with this, but my understanding is that the major sticking point is a clause that, in its current form, is legally invalid. I'm no lawyer either, but I don't think the court can force the CCCC to abide by an agreement that breaks the law. I feel like the only thing the court can do here is compel the two sides to resume negotiations.

 

Based on what's been written it seems the CCCC is claiming no agreement (invalid or otherwise) exists. Purely based on what's been reported the CCCC does have an agreement with the Portland Pirates. If the CCCC enters a courtroom with the Pirates as a defendant the CCCC is going to get its arse kicked.

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I think the CCCC is going to win. I'm not a lawyer, but I own apartment and commercial buildings so I do know a lot about leases. First of all a big red flag that this isn't a legit contract is the length of it. Their is no way either the city of Portland or the Pirates are signing a 5 year multi-million dollar lease that is one page long. Even a lease for an apartment I rent month to month is at least 10 pages because all good leases need to be overloaded with every mundane to prevent lawsuits. Also the second thing is the liquor license thing. If it is true that it is illegal for the Pirates to profit from it it automatically voids the contract because an illegal contract is an unenforcable contract whether it was agreed verbally or signed with blood.

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I think the CCCC is going to win. I'm not a lawyer, but I own apartment and commercial buildings so I do know a lot about leases. First of all a big red flag that this isn't a legit contract is the length of it. Their is no way either the city of Portland or the Pirates are signing a 5 year multi-million dollar lease that is one page long. Even a lease for an apartment I rent month to month is at least 10 pages because all good leases need to be overloaded with every mundane to prevent lawsuits. Also the second thing is the liquor license thing. If it is true that it is illegal for the Pirates to profit from it it automatically voids the contract because an illegal contract is an unenforcable contract whether it was agreed verbally or signed with blood.

 

Every single contract I've signed clearly stated that if one section was found to be invalid/illegal the rest of the contract was still enforceable...

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Yes that is true the Pirates have the right to enforce the contract as originally stated without the liquor agreement if they choose and also if it is detrimental to them to do such the CCCC is obligated to offer something of equal value to correct the mistake, but if they reject both options the contract is void. Their suing to enforce an illegal contract that was never signed and might or might not even be a contract in the first place so good luck with that one.

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Pirates sue Civic Center over disputed lease agreement

By Chris Roy Published: 7th September 2013

 

 

PORTLAND – The Portland Pirates have filed a lawsuit against the Cumberland County Civic Center’s Board of Trustees over failed lease negotiations to play at the downtown arena.

 

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This whole thing is nothing more than one giant pissing contest.

The Pirates contend that both sides came to an agreement back on April 17th and the trustees approved and signed the so-called lease agreement. Therefore, it’s an enforceable agreement in the state of Maine – most likely anywhere really – and the CCCC is now trying to use the liquor licensing issue as a way to getting a better deal.

I’ve read the complaint, request for injunction and affidavit from Petrovek and it’s compelling, but I’m not a lawyer and I haven’t read the briefs yet from the Civic Center so it’s difficult to weigh one over the other at the moment.

The CCCC contend that it’s nothing more than a resolution, a guide for further negotiations, and there was never a deal in place. They say it was only to allow them to further lease talks.

I’m calling bunk on that because in the time I’ve been dealing with the trustees and the Pirates they’ve never approved a set of talking points to keep taking. To further that point here is what Neal Pratt said in an April 18 article which I wrote.

“I think this was the only deal to be made at the end of the day and the question was, is it in the best interest of the county taxpayers to have this deal or not to have this deal. I think both parties worked extremely hard and if you look at the amount of work that went into this deal it was essentially the only deal to be made.”

That certainly doesn’t sound like a resolution to me.

I’m not sure how the judge will rule… I suspect he might kick them both out of the courtroom for wasting his time and tell them to fight it out in the playground or he may force them to mediation of some sort, but I think both sides will get a deal done. It might not happen until Jan. and the Pirates may have to play the entire season in Lewiston, but that’s not a doomsday problem because he’s likely to make more in Lewiston with fewer seats than he is in Portland. The Civic Center needs the Pirates because they need a tenant to pay back a $33M dollar bond.

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Do any other teams have to deal with the crap we do as Pirates fans. Between lease negotiations and affiliation changes, the past few years have sucked. I thought when we voted for the renovations things were going to finally be stable. Guess not, I really hope a deal gets done. Players probably aren't going to be to happy with the sitaution this year. Practice in Saco and have your games an hour away in Lewiston.

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The players are happy to practice in Saco because most live in OOB.... The Coyotes wanted to be in Saco. That was one of the keys to bringing them to Portland from San Antonio. As for playing in Lewiston... I think its only short-term maybe a season, two at max, if a deal isn't done. It will be more of an issue for the fan base who don't want to travel.

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The players are happy to practice in Saco because most live in OOB.... The Coyotes wanted to be in Saco. That was one of the keys to bringing them to Portland from San Antonio. As for playing in Lewiston... I think its only short-term maybe a season, two at max, if a deal isn't done. It will be more of an issue for the fan base who don't want to travel.

 

I'm gunna put you on the spot here Chris...what do you think the odds are this is all worked out by the time the current stage of renovations is complete?

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The players are happy to practice in Saco because most live in OOB.... The Coyotes wanted to be in Saco. That was one of the keys to bringing them to Portland from San Antonio. As for playing in Lewiston... I think its only short-term maybe a season, two at max, if a deal isn't done. It will be more of an issue for the fan base who don't want to travel.

 

I'm gunna put you on the spot here Chris...what do you think the odds are this is all worked out by the time the current stage of renovations is complete?

Slim... I believe that the court is going to rule in favor of the CCCC in regard to the complaint, but rule in favor of the Pirates on the injunction sending both parties back to the drawing board for 90 day negotiating period -- a form of mediation. The Pirates will begin this entire season in Lewiston, but will have a lease in place for the 2014-'15 season.

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It sounded to me that the legal advice the CCCC was seeking was to find out where they stand if the Pirates were to sue, not to see what they could sue for, so I would not have expected the Pirates to be a defendant.

 

Even if the CCCC prevails in court, they still come out the stinky party of the second part.  The whole liquor issue shows bad faith.  Assuming it is the CCCC (or whatever they govern) that owns the license, they should have known the situation.  If they offered some of the liquor revenue, they were wrong to do so.  Even if the Pirates asked for it, them saying "Okey Dokey" shows bad faith.  I can see the prat Pratt kicking back with a cold one chuckling how they pulled the wool over the Pirates' eyes on that one.

 

The argument that giving an equitably offsetting amount on food sales would cause them to have a loss is bogus, unless they expected to have the same amount of loss from liquor sales, but knew they wouldn't have to pay it.

 

I can also foresee at least one member of the board being replaced.  Legal action is not cheap...probably cost even more that a few more percentage points on the food sales.

 

 

Good luck Pirates fans.  :cheers:

Edited by Soc/key Season

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So much for that lawsuit. According to WCSH6 in Portland they have uncovered documents signed by both parties on April 30th stating that they agree to keep negotiating, but that the document signed in no way is a binding agreement and either party could pull out at any time. They have a video on their website sorry I couldn't post a link because I watched it from their app on my phone.

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Pirates, CCCC meet to discuss lease stalemate
By Chris Roy Published: 11th September 2013
 

 


PORTLAND – Attorneys representing the Cumberland County Civic Center and Portland Pirates met in court for nearly eight hours on Wednesday to see if they could reach a settlement in a lease dispute over the right to play in the downtown arena.



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Coyotes watching Pirates lease dispute closely

By Chris Roy Published: 12th September 2013

PORTLAND – The Portland Pirates are set to open its training camp in less than two weeks at MHG Ice Centre in Saco, but where the team will play its home games once renovations of the Cumberland County Civic Center are complete is still a concern for the National Hockey League parent club, Phoenix Coyotes.

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